Identifying/getting Running My Lpg

[Sharanfx]

I have a VR6 Sharan that has LPG fitted but not working.

 

I first need to identify the system fitted to the car.

 

http://www.fxs.co.uk/webpics/Gas.jpg

 

This is a pic with the components that I have Identified in the engine bay which is a single point on the front of the throttle body.

It has a rear spare wheel tank and a rear bumber fill point.

 

My main objective is to identify the system and then check some basic electrical connections to the solinoids etc. before refilling it with gas and getting it checked at a LPG agent.

 

I recieved no paperwork what so ever with the car so if any one can help and provide me with some info, or even better a user guide/installers guide, that would be of great help.

 

Thanks in advance. :rolleyes:

[johnb80]

You wont get insurance if you don't have the certificate for it. You would perhaps be quicker to get it down to a specialist to get it working and certified.

 

Regards - JB

[Guest vr6galaxy]

You appear to have a single point system, not a good idea on a VR6 :D the gas is injected after the throttle body and fills the inlet manifold, this is a lot gas waiting to go bang! DO NOT! fill the system and try it until you get it looked at by a pro!

one of the first things you should do is get a decent set of plugs and leads and possibly a coil pack! LPG needs a good spark to ignite it!

and now to point out whats what under the bonnet! the big metal thing with hoses and wires going to and from it is the engine :rolleyes: and a very nice one it is :(

the two boxes in front of the battery are the LPG ECU and emulator, the emulator fools the OE ECU that the petrol injectors are working when the gas system is operating in order to keep the engine running ie ignition etc, the thing to the left of the battery is the Vaporisor, this converts the liquid LPG into a gas by heating it using the engine coolant, this means that the engine normally starts on petrol and the swaps over to LPG when the engine is warm and the coolant is warm enough to convert the liquid LPG into a gas, the thing after the throttle body is the mixer, this injects the LPG into the inlet system, this is simply a jet that injects the LPG into the airflow and mixes it, to enable it to ignite!

no insult meant but the system you have is a rather basic system and can have problems if not set up correctly! get a pro to look at it!

when you removed the OE air box was it modified in any way? a one way spring loaded flap fitted? if so this was anti back fire valve! it opens under pressure of an explosion and vents the pressure and so stops the manifold from shattering and the throttle body getting damaged! at present you K&N is toast if the engine bacfires while on LPG! :D

also a single point system like this can cause noticable power loss! compared to petrol and is not that efficient :D

where about are you located?

[Sharanfx]

It had no Airbox or air meter when I obtained the car as it was previously striped with loads of parts missing. The mixer is situated just before the throttle body not after as you might not be able to see.

 

I know the single type is not the most efficient type of system, but I just want a basic system to potter around town in, as the VR6 has pleanty of torque even if running with a 15%+ loss on Gas. :unsure: Shes a old girl and the cost of a multipoint system just isnt justified on her. So Im just trying to get the old one running again

 

It has just had a new set of Leads and plugs full service and coil pack is working fine. No fault codes recorded in the ECU as read by a 5052 and the standard system is all working fine with no problems.

 

When it still had some gas in it it would either cut out as the gas switched over after a short blip of the throttle and you hear the solinoid click or it would switch over fine and then cut out after 1 min running on gas.

 

The main aim was to just clean up a few connectors and do some obvious fault findind and try to get it running, before taking it in to specialist to have it fully tested.

 

Im based in West London and just want to get the thing going again.

 

Any one got any ideas on what make it might be if.

[steve67car]

:blink: have you thought about your local vw dealer they may be able to id the unit if a dealer fit ? :unsure: just an idea

[Guest vr6galaxy]

Any one got any ideas on what make it might be if.?

 

that could a hard one to answer! there are several manufactures of LPG systems, a lot of the parts are interchangeable! it depends on the space under the bonnet on what the installer can get in? when you tried to run it on gas was the engine warm? how much gas was in the tank? do you have a change over switch on the dash with a level idicator? as these are not the most accurate of gauges! and can tell major lies!

to be honest you really want to get it checked out by a pro before you fill it with gas and try to run it! after all according to Jb80 its a bomb waiting to go off :unsure:

[johnb80]

When it still had some gas in it it would either cut out as the gas switched over after a short blip of the throttle and you hear the solinoid click or it would switch over fine and then cut out after 1 min running on gas.

 

If it cuts out after a minute or so running on gas, double check that the evaporator is getting hot. It should be plumbed in to the hot water circuit (usually tee'd into the heater hoses). If it's not hot the lpg will freeze it up as it turns from liquid to gas.

 

Regards - JB

[Sharanfx]

Cheers for the tips guys, still no luck identifying the make.

 

Will do a bit of genral checking and fault finding and then put a bit more gas in it.

As far as I can tell water continuesly flows through the evaporator which seems to get hot. I can remember condensation building up on the pipe from the evaporator to the mixer when it would run.

 

Then if all else fails I will get it down to a local centre to check it and wait for the big bill. :(

[Guest vr6galaxy]

Any names on the Electronic boxes in front of the battery? or on the vapouriser?

as said earlier there are quite a few manufacturers of LPG kits and at times its a mix and match job!

just a few names to kick of the list are Autronics, Omvl, Tartarini, Kargas, Bigas, Leonardo, Landi Renz

[Guest marcusheawood]

...to be honest the system is so primitive that i'm not surprised it cuts out.

 

It's probably a kludge for motorway use only, I know you live in West London and the traffic's pretty gnarly there but try zipping down the M3 one evening.

 

Drive the car on petrol until you hit the motorway at Sunbury (by which time it'll be properly warmed up), hoof it up to 70 in top gear then flick the switch. see if you make it past the M25 on gas only.

 

If it still cuts out then I'll wager it's a solenoid or relay not latching.

 

The make of system is unimportant, all the primitive systems basically work the same way. If you can't do the work yourself, get the system serviced by a local LPG firm. The fault should be easy to find, but don't kid yourself about the performance of this system in London traffic; it probably isn't suitable.

 

The VR6 is far from torquey, even on optimax!

[Sharanfx]

I`ll give it a try later in the week. Thanks for all the advice.

 

Its just finding time to do anything these days :)

 

Will keep you all posted if I get it sorted

[Sharanfx]

Thought I would update you all on my LPG.

 

Finally got round to having a loot at it, found a crushed feed pipe from the tank to the engine. which was restricting flow of LPG, replaced the pipe front to back.

 

This totally solved the cutting out and hesitation.

 

Its a great drive on LPG with a slight reduction in power and a slightly rougher Idle, but no major flaws. I though it was going to preform a lot worse on single point LPG personally....Well Happy :ph34r:

 

Just going to have the system re-inspected, then 45p/LTR hear I come.

 

If any one has a manual or user guide for a Leonardo Millenium LPG system etc let me know and I will compansate you for a copy.

 

Thanks.

[johnb80]

Thats good news, the lumpy idle is strange, my Range Rover was noticeably smoother on LPG including idle than on petrol. LPG burns slower than the petrol vapour and thus doesn't give the same crack to the piston hence smoother. Have you had the idle mixture on gas checked? if it's rich the idle will be lumpy.

 

Regards - John

[Sharanfx]

Going to get the Idle checked out, Overall the car is a lot smoother.

 

On the motorway you cant even here the engine just the road noise when its on LPG.

Spooky :(

[Masked Marauder]

Good to hear you got it sorted chap. 47p a litre? I might swap my TDi...... Nah!

[morticiaskeeper]

Wouldn't pay more than 41p/litre. But glad you got it sorted. Just finding out about my system is taking a long time.